[Guest eysteinh]

This is marked for the orange/yellow bar with Cash conversion cost* in * it reads:"* Cash cost of converting polysilicon into solar panels. Includes freight." So freight is included in cash conversion costs. I stil have no answer yet on if they include warrenty and insurance in these costs or if this is put in sg&a so keep this in mind. But for freight thats pretty much what they state.

[explo 629]

Klothilde, the 47 cents target is not new with this report. We concluded that REC targets seems "Chinese" already in their Q4 report. I brought it up a couple of times. How can Singapore be low cost? To me it seems the should be higher than Malaysia and and other mid cost markets and much higher than China. Maybe even higher than Europe. What's up with low cost manufacturing in Singapore?

[odyd 1,304]

I should have cropped the picture properly, yes . So 0.50 it is, very good target to have. Thanks I think I am getting overwhelmed with the tasks here.

[Guest Klothilde]

Well didn't Eystein say automation is the answer?

[Guest eysteinh]

Well automation might perhaps be one of the answers. Granular FBR cost advantage and the reuse of crucibles because of patented coating another. And the driver for cost reduction forward must be the two new machines, the 2000kg ingot ovens and the centrotherm diffusion ovens they recently purchased. Also one might note they made a breakthrough in slurry recycling if one reads the technology update section carefully. If they have an extremly efficent ingot process then this could be the major reason. But we just have to wait and see if the targets will come true. Also they data track everything so they are allways doing optimization of the automatation systems. I guess if you go down an inline automation route you need to have a team dedicated to optimizing this all the time.

[explo 629]

Yes, but I still don't get why Singapore can come close to China and other non-China sites cannot..?

Maybe my assumption is wrong, but are other players than Chinese and REC guiding for module cost in low to mid 50 cents?

I don't think the China edge a discussion of labor vs automation and cost of labor anymore. It's about manufacturing hub or not. What does it cost to set up shop and get supplies? The infrastructure for cheap solutions for this is in place inside China. Am I looking at this the wrong way?

Anyway it is a major plus for REC and I said for awhile that REC Solar has a great position for 2013. I just don't fully understand why they can reach Chinese level when no one else can.

[Guest Klothilde]

FSLR had production cost of 56 cents in Q4 2012, slightly less than TSL and YGE. They produce mainly in Malaysia.

[Guest mena]

REC Singapore has shifted from European suppliers to asian suppliers wich is the same as the chinese. This has driven cost down alot. Automation is the other key, stable production with flawless precision. Add that chinese wages will always rise while automation will have the same cost over the time.

[Pop2mollys 414]

http://www.streetinsider.com/Press+Releases/LDK+Solar+Signs+Second+Share+Purchase+Agreement+with+Fulai+Investments/8281083.html

[explo 629]

Thanks. Who are these Fulai that keeps funneling pennies to cover Jack Lai's liabilities (worst CFO ever)? LDK are now hooked on monthly dilutions.

[Guest solarking]

Fulai Investments Limited, a company wholly owned by Chinese businessman Cheng Kin Ming which is incorporated in the British Virgin Islands. http://www.photovoltaic-production.com/tag/fulai-investments-limited/

[explo 629]

thanks

[Guest ILOVEPV]

Some entity definetely supports LDK share price. Probably from China. The stock should have been trading around 10-20 cents. Can you imagine a situation if SOL or TSL made a 25M dilution? It would have been dropped immediately 30%.

[explo 629]

Yes, the trading doesn't make sense. If you think it will survive then the 15% diliution should take the stock lower. If you think it is dying then 25m infusion makes no difference and the stock should not trade at these levels at all.

[Guest joshchang]

Yes, the trading doesn't make sense. If you think it will survive then the 15% diliution should take the stock lower. If you think it is dying then 25m infusion makes no difference and the stock should not trade at these levels at all.

Anyone who would like to pay money for LDK's equity is good news for LDK considering it has negative equity now and it increases its chance for survival. Another interesting news came out today: Hefei local government tried to persuade JASO, JKS and TSl to take over capacity they bought back from LDK but they all refused to take over the burden. http://www.21cbh.com/HTML/2013-4-25/2MNDE3XzY3MjM2MQ.html

[explo 629]

Thanks. Yes, I suspected the JASO entry commitment to Hefei and the LDK exit from Hefei would make for a natural transfer of capacity. What's the angle with JKS (can see that they need to add capacity at some point) and TSL (don't see them with big need to add capacity and I'm not seeing them wanting to have a plant in Hefei)? No surprise that JKS and TSL refuse. JASO might want a good deal first. It's a chance to get away with less than the RMB 13.5b they committed to invest in Hefei.

[Guest joshchang]

Thanks. Yes, I suspected the JASO entry commitment to Hefei and the LDK exit from Hefei would make for a natural transfer of capacity. What's the angle with JKS (can see that they need to add capacity at some point) and TSL (don't see them with big need to add capacity and I'm not seeing them wanting to have a plant in Hefei)? No surprise that JKS and TSL refuse. JASO might want a good deal first. It's a chance to get away with less than the RMB 13.5b they committed to invest in Hefei.

A big portion of the capacity LDK left at Hefei is cell capacity. Any domestic cell capacity represents certain risk when the tariff decision from Europe is still unclear. Anyone who wants to take over the capacity also need to take over the debt. So I would assume cash-hungered JKS won't do it. JASO already has too much domestically produced cell and would be reluctant to increase its exposure. TSL is too prudent to take over the huge debt. Unless Hefei government can pay off the debt first and offer the capacity at a reasonable price.

[explo 629]

Thanks. Tough for Hefei.

[odyd 1,304]

Thank you Josh, seems to be that nobody wants this, as I mentioned before. It also appears that city does not want to break into solar industry on its own any time soon. Explo I am still seeing you say that JA has some sort of death agreement to build in there. You do not believe this uneconomical and unnecessary move can be aborted? In mho those MOUs are all flush down the toilet long time ago.

[explo 629]

Thank you Josh, seems to be that nobody wants this, as I mentioned before. It also appears that city does not want to break into solar industry on its own any time soon. Explo I am still seeing you say that JA has some sort of death agreement to build in there. You do not believe this uneconomical and unnecessary move can be aborted? In mho those MOUs are all flush down the toilet long time ago.

From the 20-F filed 10 days ago: "In February 2011, we entered into an investment agreement with the Management Committee of Hefei High-Tech Industrial Development Zone, or Hefei Committee, in relation to the establishment and development of the Hefei manufacturing center. Under this agreement, we agreed to develop an integrated solar power product manufacturing center in the Hefei High-Tech Industrial Development Zone, with a long-term target manufacturing capacity of 3.0 GW of solar power products, including silicon wafer, solar cells and solar modules. Our solar module manufacturing facility in Hefei has commenced operation in the second quarter of 2012." It doesn't sound like Hefei have let this pass. The original timeline is obviously revised and the original cost projection might not apply, but Hefei still expects JA to place their expansion there, so I would think there's an opportunity for JA to get away on the cheap here with Hefei stuck with LDK's plant. Here are the details given by the company in a filing June 2011: http://investors.jasolar.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=208005&p=irol-SECText&TEXT=aHR0cDovL2FwaS50ZW5rd2l6YXJkLmNvbS9maWxpbmcueG1sP2lwYWdlPTc2Njk5ODQmRFNFUT0wJlNFUT0wJlNRREVTQz1TRUNUSU9OX0VOVElSRSZzdWJzaWQ9NTc%3d